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4153 Members
81 Forums
13467 Topics
170904 Posts
Max Online: 722 @ 04/10/08 12:10 PM
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#35071 - 03/03/04 09:41 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: SKAB]
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Registered: 02/22/04
Loc: Springfield M.A
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I have expereinced hearing loss due to loud music and drumming. When I first started marching it was not even a consideration to wear earplugs. When I stopped marching we were told to wear earplugs. The first reason was for our hearing and the next was the ear tampons allow you to hear more clearly the whole line there by making cleaner.
Or thats what they told us.
_________________________
Semper Gumby: Always maintain a rigid state of flexibility. http://www.vater.com/
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#35073 - 03/03/04 11:24 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: arithmetic007]
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Registered: 05/15/03
Loc: buffalo, mn , usa
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Yeah.... I am playing tenors this year and my left ear is towards the snare and I can tell its going bad. It hurts around highpitched noises and sometimes if Im playing a snare in a practice room or something my ear starts getting a crackling noise. I wear earplugs whenever i can remember now.
_________________________
Minnesota Brass Inc. Plates '06
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#35078 - 03/04/04 04:17 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: bpdrums]
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Registered: 08/07/03
Loc: †
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The threshold of pain really doesn't matter...as hearing damage occurs at a much lower level, about 85 decibels.
_________________________
Instructor, ECU Marching Percussion (2004) Endorser, Vic Firth sticks and mallets [color:"red"] EIRT [/color][color:"yellow"] Ålpha [/color]
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#35082 - 03/04/04 10:52 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: jimi_thing]
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Registered: 11/20/03
Loc: Holland, Michigan
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i haven't worn ear plugs when i'm around drums, and neither do our instructors. none of us have experienced any hearing loss, or at least nothing that is noticeable.
_________________________
"We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of the dream. Wandering by lone sea breakers, and sitting by desolate streams. World losers and world forsakers, for whom the pale moon gleams. Yet we are movers and the shakers of the world forever it seems." - Arthur O'Shaunessey "Even broken clocks are right twice a day." - Fallon Young, Scary Go Round[color:"blue"]Director of The Hot Air Drum and Bugle Corps[/color]
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#35083 - 03/04/04 10:52 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: jimi_thing]
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Registered: 09/17/02
Loc: Slidell, Louisiana
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Yeah, I've noticed a slight loss of hearing. Playing snare, I have always had 3-2 snares on my left. When I was an underclassman, I was all the way on the right, so my left got 3 snares, two of which are rimshot freaks. This year, I am 3rd from left as captain, and have two guys on my left, one is another rimshot aholic. My left is worse than my right as a result. I have the military issued earplugs in that little puke green case attached to my car keys (stole from my Army brother) but I forget to put them in alot a lot, so that sucks...
_________________________
I play drums.
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#35084 - 03/04/04 10:53 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: jimi_thing]
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Registered: 08/07/03
Loc: †
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I don't wear them either. Guess I'll just go deaf. 
_________________________
Instructor, ECU Marching Percussion (2004) Endorser, Vic Firth sticks and mallets [color:"red"] EIRT [/color][color:"yellow"] Ålpha [/color]
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#35085 - 03/04/04 10:55 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: bpdrums]
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Registered: 11/20/03
Loc: Holland, Michigan
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i wonder if anybody has actually measured the difference in decibel level of a line playing on the head at level 4 and a line playing rimshots at level 4...perhaps the rimshot level is above the threshold of pain...
_________________________
"We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of the dream. Wandering by lone sea breakers, and sitting by desolate streams. World losers and world forsakers, for whom the pale moon gleams. Yet we are movers and the shakers of the world forever it seems." - Arthur O'Shaunessey "Even broken clocks are right twice a day." - Fallon Young, Scary Go Round[color:"blue"]Director of The Hot Air Drum and Bugle Corps[/color]
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#35086 - 03/05/04 11:28 AM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: ADLMalletTech]
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Registered: 06/26/01
Loc: Hewitt, NJ
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Guys, I would seriously advise that you wear earplugs. Having been in/around marching band/corps for over 19 years, I have lost approximately 25% of my hearing in the left ear and 35% in my right. I also have occasional tinitus in my right ear (comes and goes at random intervals) which gets pretty loud. I have trouble hearing conversations, and I can't make out anything certain pitched voices are saying. Mind you, I do not crank up the volume of the radio or TV when I listen to music, nor do I work in a loud noise environment, so all of the damage has been from my marching activities.
Whether you are playing snare, tenors, bassdrum, or even a vibraslap, wear earplugs. Cotton is not good enough as it does not cut out enough decibels to prevent damage. While you might not notice the effects right now, you will when you are older, and I can tell you they're not pleasant. Please wear them.
_________________________
The Cavaliers - Baritone 1993
Hawthorne Caballeros - Baritone 1988, Contra 1989-1995, Bass 6/5 1996-1998
Pequannock HS - Marching Instructor 1995
Saddle Brook HS - Percussion Instructor 1995
Lodi HS - Percussion Instructor 1996-2003
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#35087 - 03/05/04 12:16 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: ADLMalletTech]
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Registered: 08/07/03
Loc: †
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Quote:
AHSbassman02 said:
i wonder if anybody has actually measured the difference in decibel level of a line playing on the head at level 4 and a line playing rimshots at level 4...perhaps the rimshot level is above the threshold of pain...
Modern Drummer did a really cool study a few years ago that was kind of similar to this. They measured all of the previously mentioned noise sources (airplanes, traffic noise, rock concerts, etc), but they also measured specific percussion instruments: snare drums, basses, toms, cymbals...and broke it down by size. They also said how many "hits" you could take from each instrument and how long (time length) you could be subjected to it before hearing damage would begin. I remember them saying that one rimshot causes damage (1 rimshot, 1 time, everytime). It's too bad I don't have my old mags here at school or I would break it all down.
I would guess that rimshots are well above the threshold of pain (especially in certain environments). However, I would also guess that prolonged exposure to a line playing 8's (or anything) at a f-ff (maybe even lower) level will get you the same kind of problems.
_________________________
Instructor, ECU Marching Percussion (2004) Endorser, Vic Firth sticks and mallets [color:"red"] EIRT [/color][color:"yellow"] Ålpha [/color]
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#35088 - 03/05/04 04:15 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: mantis]
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Registered: 04/25/00
Loc: Drumlines.org Server
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I never wore any kind of hearing protection while drumming until a couple of years ago. I am only 25 and have constant tinnitus already. It is impossible for me to go asleep in a quiet room. I cannot stand just being in a quiet room because the ringing is just too annoying. Here's a table of the results of my last annual hearing test on 28 August. | 500HZ | 10 | 10 | | 10,000HZ | 10 | 10 | | 20,000HZ | 15 | 10 | | 30,000HZ | 20 | 05 | | 40,000HZ | 15 | 10 | | 60,000HZ | 30 | 25 | | 80,000HZ | 05 | 15 | I do believe the decibels mean that is how loud a sound at that frequency has to be before I can hear it. And remember, a sound at 20 decibels is twice as loud as a sound at 10 decibels, a sound at 30 decibels is four times as loud as a sound at 10 decibels, and so forth. Use hearing protection kids.
_________________________
I'm a whorePerformingGreat Mills HS: '92-'96 -> Front Ensemble, Plates, Snare | Baltimore Ravens: '00-'03 -> Snare TeachingThomas Stone HS: '97-'99 | Patuxent HS: '99
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#35089 - 03/05/04 04:27 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: DLWebmaestro]
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Registered: 04/25/00
Loc: Drumlines.org Server
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I just wanted to add an ammendum to my last post. I'm double-posting because I don't feel like messing with the table again, and I'm the Maestro and I can do whatever I want. 
| | | | softest audible sound | 0 dB | | normal breathing | 10 dB | | rustling leaves | 20 dB | | whispering | 25 dB | | clothes dryer | 60 dB | | normal conversation | 60 dB | | dishwasher | 65 dB | | car | 70 dB | | busy traffic | 75 dB | | alarm clock | 80 dB | | noisy restaurant | 80 dB | | average factory | 85 dB | | screaming child | 90 dB | | subway train | 100 dB | | diesel truck | 100 dB | | jackhammer | 100 dB | | helicopter | 105 dB | | power mower | 105 dB | | shouting in ear | 110 dB | | live rock music | 90-130 dB | | football stadium | 117 dB | | band concert | 120 dB | | thunder | 120 dB | | car horn | 120 dB | | jackhammer | 130 dB | | air raid siren | 130 dB | | noisy squeeze toys | 135 dB | | PAIN STARTS | 140 dB | | gunshot | 140 dB | | jet engine | 140 dB | | rocket launching | 180 dB | | loudest sound | 194 dB |
Notice the level for a football stadium. Of course, this is for the NFL or a very large university. Add drumming to that. Yeah, it starts to hurt come half-time. And yes, I notice the table seems to be a bit confused about a jackhammer, but I didn't make the table. 
Edited by DLWebmaestro (03/05/04 04:32 PM)
_________________________
I'm a whorePerformingGreat Mills HS: '92-'96 -> Front Ensemble, Plates, Snare | Baltimore Ravens: '00-'03 -> Snare TeachingThomas Stone HS: '97-'99 | Patuxent HS: '99
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#35094 - 03/06/04 03:27 AM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: DLWebmaestro]
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Registered: 08/07/03
Loc: †
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I've been reading a lot about this stuff online since this thread was started. And... I've looked at a lot of charts like the one DL inserted. I'm confused about one thing though. A gunshot is 140dB, which is in the "red zone" or hearing damage area right? Are we supposed to assume that the gunshot is happening right by our ear? If not, how close do we have to be for hearing damage to occur? It seems to me that distance should play an important part in these figures. Hmmm... 
_________________________
Instructor, ECU Marching Percussion (2004) Endorser, Vic Firth sticks and mallets [color:"red"] EIRT [/color][color:"yellow"] Ålpha [/color]
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#35095 - 03/06/04 02:04 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: mantis]
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Registered: 03/06/04
Loc: Dartmouth, MA(but recently mov...
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OK. Lets go off of that. Now any snare drummer knows, when a rimshot takes place on the drum to the left and/or right, assuming that the actual drums have Kevlar heads and the rimshot is played at a stick height of 9 in., it sounds similar to a gunshot (if done correctly). Measure the distance from the other player's drum head to you're own ear. Thats how close the gun is. Now think of how many times it occurs during a show. Now think of Indoor Shows.
Also, it is the high range dBs that we need to look out for. The high register of the vibes and xylo, all cymbals, concert bells are the worst, krytales, and the snare. Hearing loss will usually start with our high end registar. If we slow that down, we have a better chance to keep our hearing fairly normal for a longer period of time.
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#35096 - 03/06/04 02:26 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: batman98]
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Registered: 08/07/03
Loc: †
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If the gunshot is coming from where a snaredrum would be, then yes, that would be damaging. But what I'm saying is, how far away do you have to be before there is no damage? What if you're 2 people away? 3-4? 20 yards? It just seems vague to me for a figure to say "a gunshot produces 140 dB and that is harmful." Well...from precisely what distance is that harmful? It's raining today, so I have a lot of extra time to think about things like this while I'm trying to keep dry under this leaf here.
_________________________
Instructor, ECU Marching Percussion (2004) Endorser, Vic Firth sticks and mallets [color:"red"] EIRT [/color][color:"yellow"] Ålpha [/color]
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#35098 - 03/06/04 03:20 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: batman98]
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Registered: 06/16/00
Loc: Southern MD
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also, if you think you're losing hearing, go get checked out by an ear, nose and throat doctor. I have had ear problems since I was 2. About a year after graduating from high school, I started to lose hearing, so I thought that maybe drumline had to do something with it. I checked with my doctor and it wasnt hearing loss, just some painful blockage right on the ear drum. It was painful to be taken out, but when I was cleared up, I could hear things so crisply. No doubt this helped me save my hearing. That's right folks, some ear wax blockage saved my hearing! I'd say it did atleast.
Anyways folks, if you ever get the feeling that everything is soft and quiet after you've played 8's for a while, you've lost some hearing. WHenever you get that feeling, where everything sounds quiet after you've been around some prolonged noise, you've damaged your ears. You'll regain your hearing, but you'll never be back at 100% ever again.
Do what you wish, but you'll be sorry if you dont wear ear plugs.
_________________________
-KevinInstructor/Tech Northern HS - Owings, MD | Winter '03 - Fall '04 Patuxent HS - Lusby, MD | Fall '06 Huntingtown HS - Huntingtown, MD | Fall '07 Project PIW - Pittsburgh, PA | '05 - Cymbals Promote Tolerance| Go Redskins! 
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#35099 - 03/06/04 03:44 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: batman98]
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Registered: 08/07/03
Loc: †
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Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. It would be helpful to include distances/conditions with the numbers because while a gunshot could still be harmful from 5 yards away, a noisy squeeze toy (which produces similar dB) would probably be relatively harmless from the same distance. Like you said, there's all kinds of things to consider...so just saying "140 dB" is bad, is a little vague.
Also Kevin, what you're talking about seems to be pretty common in people who spend a lot of time around loud noises. The ear tries to protect itself. We see a lot of it at the clinic. Aren't ear irrigations wonderful? You wouldn't believe the crap that comes out of peoples' ears. 
_________________________
Instructor, ECU Marching Percussion (2004) Endorser, Vic Firth sticks and mallets [color:"red"] EIRT [/color][color:"yellow"] Ålpha [/color]
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#35101 - 03/06/04 03:51 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: batman98]
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Registered: 08/07/03
Loc: †
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You can also get them cheap/free if you're at a university. Just make sure they understand you're there for the hearing test...and not the STD test...
_________________________
Instructor, ECU Marching Percussion (2004) Endorser, Vic Firth sticks and mallets [color:"red"] EIRT [/color][color:"yellow"] Ålpha [/color]
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#35105 - 05/01/04 04:39 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: Trimen1000]
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blanks
Registered: 05/01/04
Loc: South Point Ohio
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What kind of earplugs would you use? I have some lyng around the house that are for like swimming underwater and stuff. Will those work?
_________________________
-Justin Wood <img src="/threads/images/graemlins/lol.gif" alt="" />
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#35106 - 05/01/04 04:47 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: PsYkKoSnarE]
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Registered: 06/16/00
Loc: Southern MD
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go to CVS and buy some...they're like $2-5, depending on how many and how high decibels you want to reduce. check the back of them. some of them have decibel relation scales (such as how loud a tractor is, a rock concert, etc). It'll be a good investment.
_________________________
-KevinInstructor/Tech Northern HS - Owings, MD | Winter '03 - Fall '04 Patuxent HS - Lusby, MD | Fall '06 Huntingtown HS - Huntingtown, MD | Fall '07 Project PIW - Pittsburgh, PA | '05 - Cymbals Promote Tolerance| Go Redskins!
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#35108 - 05/26/04 03:36 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: batman98]
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blank
Registered: 05/24/04
Loc: Nevada, Missouri
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I've never noticed any hearing problems. I'm playing snare this year and we have two underclassmen who are big fans of the rimshots. I play in a rock band, and I'm around firearms pretty regularly. I even go to the races every now and then, but I've never noticed any hearing loss. Normally the line practices outside but occassionally we're in the band room and yeah it's loud but not deafing. Our instructor doesn't enforce any hearing protection so none is worn. None of us are losing any hearing. Maybe that's just us though.
_________________________
Aquaduct~~Eric
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#35109 - 05/26/04 08:30 PM
Re: Hearing Loss
[Re: gbrnnn]
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Registered: 06/16/00
Loc: Southern MD
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...... YET. The trend seems to be that you'll gain symptoms of it AFTER your high school days. Usually about 5 years afterwards you'll notice some differences in your hearing.I said this in a related thread, but you chose to reply in this one instead .
_________________________
-KevinInstructor/Tech Northern HS - Owings, MD | Winter '03 - Fall '04 Patuxent HS - Lusby, MD | Fall '06 Huntingtown HS - Huntingtown, MD | Fall '07 Project PIW - Pittsburgh, PA | '05 - Cymbals Promote Tolerance| Go Redskins!
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